Bongofish

Screen Tablet malarky => Successful builds! => Topic started by: DonShole on February 03, 2007, 12:37:09 PM



Title: Success ** Dontiq - FINISHED!
Post by: DonShole on February 03, 2007, 12:37:09 PM
So, there I was snooping around youtube looking at cintiqs and I came across this.  That was followed by the ubiquitous, "Wow", "I gotta do this!", "If it works..." and so on.  And now here I am.  A long way to go.
Bought a 15" Packard Bell monitor (L15CX with external power brick) off ebay for £68.  Very bright monitor - I hope to use the monitor frame itself to house the "Dontiq".   Received it yesterday and started stripping it last night.  Pretty easy, mostly screws to deal with.  I have loads of photos but haven't had time to upload them here.
I'm stuck on unscrewing the lcd side panel from the backlight housing - tiny screws and I haven't bought a Dremel yet. 

Also ordered a Nisis Easy Pen tablet.
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Nisis-Easypen-Graphics-Tablet-12x9/dp/B00006IZBO/sr=8-8/qid=1170502407/ref=sr_1_8/202-7499765-6157468?ie=UTF8&s=electronics
From my reasearch it seams that the hardware is the same Aiptek.  Still waiting for that to arrive.

Cost so far £118, 1 hour 40 minutes.


**EDIT**

I've had my share of mishaps doing this.  First of all, Nisis tablets are rubbish! - for this project.  I broke a CCFL from the L15CX monitor, replacing it didn't help.  It turned out the lcd pcbs got shorted out after the one ccfl broke.  I replaced it with a packard bell CT500c.  The same monitor except, no speakers, the actual lcd is a lg phillips and, the column driver board causes interference on a ud12x12r IF   it is completely over the tablet sensor.  Shielding stops this.  Strangely I get some minor jittering on my desktop but not on the laptop I was doing all my testing with.  My " rebuild" cost is ct500c £45 incl shipping, ud12x2r £51 including shipping.

It's been fun! 

(http://img162.imageshack.us/img162/4999/pict0578bq8.jpg)

(http://img176.imageshack.us/img176/4104/pict0583withtextcopyze5.jpg)

(http://img176.imageshack.us/img176/9622/pict0589withtextkw1.jpg)

(http://img257.imageshack.us/img257/1363/pict0592textcopykv0.jpg)

(http://img182.imageshack.us/img182/2024/pict0593textcopyqh8.jpg)

(http://img295.imageshack.us/img295/5028/pict0595textcopyso6.jpg)

(http://img295.imageshack.us/img295/9245/pict0597textcopywk8.jpg)

(http://img295.imageshack.us/img295/2298/pict0600textcopyac7.jpg)

(http://img338.imageshack.us/img338/5941/pict0611dontiqgp6.th.jpg) (http://img338.imageshack.us/my.php?image=pict0611dontiqgp6.jpg)

(http://img168.imageshack.us/img168/3889/pict0646dontiqby3.th.jpg) (http://img168.imageshack.us/my.php?image=pict0646dontiqby3.jpg)

(http://img405.imageshack.us/img405/914/pict0654dontiqcm5.th.jpg) (http://img405.imageshack.us/my.php?image=pict0654dontiqcm5.jpg)

(http://img180.imageshack.us/img180/2853/pict0664dontiquu7.th.jpg) (http://img180.imageshack.us/my.php?image=pict0664dontiquu7.jpg)

(http://img339.imageshack.us/img339/6263/pict0696dontiqzt8.th.jpg) (http://img339.imageshack.us/my.php?image=pict0696dontiqzt8.jpg)

(http://img140.imageshack.us/img140/2633/pict0705dontiqfk3.th.jpg) (http://img140.imageshack.us/my.php?image=pict0705dontiqfk3.jpg)

(http://img184.imageshack.us/img184/7703/pict0710dontiqun0.th.jpg) (http://img184.imageshack.us/my.php?image=pict0710dontiqun0.jpg)

(http://img126.imageshack.us/img126/4949/pict0713dontiqjs7.th.jpg) (http://img126.imageshack.us/my.php?image=pict0713dontiqjs7.jpg)

(http://img258.imageshack.us/img258/888/pict0716dontiqye9.th.jpg) (http://img258.imageshack.us/my.php?image=pict0716dontiqye9.jpg)

(http://img129.imageshack.us/img129/526/pict0718dontiqbq8.th.jpg) (http://img129.imageshack.us/my.php?image=pict0718dontiqbq8.jpg)

(http://img339.imageshack.us/img339/2376/pict0721dontiqbm0.th.jpg) (http://img339.imageshack.us/my.php?image=pict0721dontiqbm0.jpg)


Title: Re: "Dontiq" ahoy!
Post by: Drewid on February 03, 2007, 04:03:21 PM
Halfords do screwdrivers down to 0 size, or a set of jewellers drivers.  They even do a rather nice miniature driver and bit set.


Title: Re: "Dontiq" ahoy!
Post by: DonShole on February 03, 2007, 05:20:17 PM
Thanks for the tip :)


Title: Re: "Dontiq" ahoy!
Post by: Chems on February 03, 2007, 06:17:23 PM
I hope you get on ok with a non wacom tablet. There is a reason they cost more. I was erring about using a WACOM but I already have one thats really good. What if you dont have the right pen distance from the screen?

I think you will find it hard to house the tablet in the screen casing as there will probably be a lot of PCB around the active area of the tablet that wont fit.



Title: Re: "Dontiq" ahoy!
Post by: DonShole on February 03, 2007, 07:08:24 PM
I hope you get on ok with a non wacom tablet. There is a reason they cost more. I was erring about using a WACOM but I already have one thats really good. What if you dont have the right pen distance from the screen?

I think you will find it hard to house the tablet in the screen casing as there will probably be a lot of PCB around the active area of the tablet that wont fit.



Yeah, a non wacom is a gamble.  But then again so is a wacom, Robcats build with an aiptek appears to have the same jitter problems as Wei's wacom build.  Read height seems to be pretty varied even in the same models, so it's an unreliable predictor of the outcome.  For me this is practise/experience build, if I see it working, I hope to build a 21" more expensive version  :)


Title: Re: "Dontiq" ahoy!
Post by: Chems on February 04, 2007, 03:29:14 PM
oh 21inch bad!

The thing about this jittering is that no ones found a proper cure for it yet. Which is worrying.


Title: Re: "Dontiq" ahoy!
Post by: Drewid on February 04, 2007, 03:43:09 PM
Looks like Rumi might have a solution, or rather a suite of solutions.


Title: Re: "Dontiq" ahoy!
Post by: Chems on February 04, 2007, 06:41:34 PM
Not the way I read his last post, hes tried a lot of things but to quote him "I did a lot of tests without much success," but Im sure the answer is out there. I just hope I dont get any major problems with jittering.

I have this intresting theory that the lower the response time of your monitor the more trouble your going to get, both Wei and Rumi are using the same monitor with a response time of 25ms.

According to google Drewids Dell 1501fp has a response time of 50ms, my monitor has a reponse time of 45ms and so far Im not having any jittering problems. Maybe some market research is needed.


Title: Re: "Dontiq" ahoy!
Post by: Tanassi on February 04, 2007, 06:55:52 PM
interesting theory... and it may be true!
i've checked the original Cintiq time response, it has 30ms, quite bad value for a modern LCD
guys... i'm in the shit... i've just ordered a 5ms response monitor :-\


Title: Re: "Dontiq" ahoy!
Post by: DonShole on February 04, 2007, 07:53:23 PM
This is not very encouraging, my monitor has a response time of 25ms. Oh well, I may just be lucky and not have problems.


Title: Re: "Dontiq" ahoy!
Post by: DonShole on February 06, 2007, 03:42:27 PM
I have updated my first post in this thread to include some pics.  Incidentaly, I tested the stripped lcd on an unstripped genius wizardpen tablet.  No jitters at all, but lots of random right clicks - these stopped after disabling the pen's right click.


Title: Re: "Dontiq" ahoy!
Post by: DonShole on February 13, 2007, 11:22:44 AM
My tablet finally arrived yesterday.  the tablet itself works fine.  read height is about 8mm above its case.  But oh the jitters.  putting the stripped screen ontop of the usntripped tablet works fine so long as the lcd is off.  When on there are instant jitters.  as ther does not appear to be a solution for jitters, i'm rethinking my build.


Title: Re: "Dontiq" ahoy!
Post by: DonShole on February 23, 2007, 12:07:19 AM
I found a wacom UD-1212-R for £40 on ebay  ;D , so I'm back in the game sooner than I thought.  If I get no jitters, I'll continue adding the remaining photos in the rest of my monitor strip.


Title: Re: "Dontiq" ahoy!
Post by: DonShole on February 27, 2007, 07:12:18 PM
My wacom arrived today.  No Jitters! WOOHOO!!! ;D
So I continue with my build.


Title: Re: "Dontiq" ahoy!
Post by: Drewid on February 27, 2007, 11:24:48 PM
Yayyyy ;D


Title: Re: "Dontiq" ahoy!
Post by: DonShole on March 01, 2007, 12:24:11 PM
Just wanted to post a video of one of my tests.  The good thing I've discovered is that it appears I can fit everything into the wacom case (with spacers) AND, I don't need to extend any cables.  Plus I've been able to save the lcds control buttons which are all on a flat flexible circuit board.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BBfhXHH8s54


Title: Re: "Dontiq" ahoy!
Post by: kubi on March 01, 2007, 01:08:14 PM
really reallly nice


Title: Re: "Dontiq" ahoy!
Post by: Chems on March 01, 2007, 01:09:17 PM
That looks awesome.

Good work!


Title: Re: "Dontiq" ahoy!
Post by: naspc on March 01, 2007, 02:44:32 PM
hey done nice job.
do you think can walk me through on how, why, and what when stacking everything together?
ex: lcd, boards, insulation etc.....
thanks!


Title: Re: "Dontiq" ahoy!
Post by: Drewid on March 01, 2007, 04:31:23 PM
Fantastic.  That's looking sweet.


Title: Re: "Dontiq" ahoy!
Post by: DonShole on March 01, 2007, 05:03:24 PM
Thanks for all your comments  :) .  I also discovered that my read height seems to have magically improved.  I mounted the screen+backlight slabs and ccfls back in the support frame, and was still getting a good response.  I'm not sure what I did or didn't do.  Here's a tip, when testing, place a glass/acrylick sheet on the lcd - I used glass from a photo frame.


Title: Re: "Dontiq" ahoy! ON HOLD
Post by: DonShole on March 14, 2007, 06:44:59 PM
After coming so close to finishing, I have to put my project on hold.  It seems after breaking a pair of my ccfls, The lcd boards got shorted out.  Replacing the ccfls has not helped.  I discovered my power adaptor light was blinking and a google revealed that this implied a short circuit somewhere.  The screen was perfect, no extensions required, nice flexible control buttons and no jittering.  I'm debating if I should try and get the lcd fixed or just buy a dell 1503fp.  In either case I'm taking a break for a few weeks.


Title: Re: "Dontiq" ahoy! ON HOLD
Post by: Messyhair on March 14, 2007, 08:36:13 PM
good luck don, it was going so good!

mess


Title: Re: Dontiq - FINISHED!
Post by: DonShole on April 06, 2007, 09:17:10 AM
So, my build is finally finished.  I can't believe I started in january.  I've updated my first post (http://forum.bongofish.co.uk/index.php?topic=222.0)with all the new info and pics.  All the anotation on the final pics was speedily done by hand on my "new" Dontiq.


Title: Re: Dontiq - FINISHED!
Post by: dynam1c on April 06, 2007, 11:29:06 PM
you are a hero. !! a great man amongst men. you have served the revolution well ...


is it me or has there been a sudden rush of completitions after a long drought of let downs?


Title: Re: Dontiq - FINISHED!
Post by: DonShole on April 07, 2007, 07:44:44 AM
 ;D.  Definately more completed builds.  Down to more collective experience I suppose.  The satisfaction of finishing is frankly amazing!


Title: Re: Dontiq - FINISHED!
Post by: Messyhair on April 07, 2007, 08:28:53 AM
Well done sir. Nice to see another working model. Going to start my build in a week or so, the pain of waiting sucks. I bet it feels awesome to customize products for yourself.  Something I plan to show everyone I know.

mess


Title: Re: Dontiq - FINISHED!
Post by: Chems on April 07, 2007, 06:10:15 PM
Nice work! Its like drews Tablets had a baby!


Title: Re: Success ** Dontiq - FINISHED!
Post by: DonShole on January 16, 2008, 11:56:06 PM
Just a little update.  Feels rather like "duh!" actually "why didn't I think of that before". I noticed some jittering after finishing my build.  Not much - could do textures and large zbrush sculpts, but it was a pain for fine details.  This jitter was not there when using the tablet on an old athlon xp laptop.  It turns out the problem was the refresh rate.  To fix it, I changed it for the tablet monitor to the maximum possible (75MHz - using the nvidia software).  Now the jitter is all but gone.  Feels really, REALLY good   ;D

Oh, and my 15inch DonTiq is way better (and cheaper) than that 12in wacom nonsense  :P

I also realised after skimming through my build log that I hadn't explained my shielding:

Dead strip - loss of sensing on a 1 inch wide strip caused by column driver.  The shielding consists of layers of regular tin foil - 8 to 10 covered in duct tape. This type of shielding fixed the dead strip but had no effect on the jittering .
(http://img213.imageshack.us/img213/7329/deadstripmi7.th.jpg) (http://img213.imageshack.us/my.php?image=deadstripmi7.jpg)


Title: Re: Success ** Dontiq - FINISHED!
Post by: Drewid on January 17, 2008, 11:53:17 PM
Thanks for the info. That's interesting.



Title: Re: Success ** Dontiq - FINISHED!
Post by: theotocopulitos on August 07, 2009, 05:59:40 PM
Thanks for "annotated photos" in the first post, they are just great for us newbies!


Title: Re: Success ** Dontiq - FINISHED!
Post by: DonShole on August 08, 2009, 11:21:27 AM
You're welcome.  Dontiq II will hopefully materialize sooner rather than later :)


Title: Re: Success ** Dontiq - FINISHED!
Post by: bernard on August 08, 2009, 04:10:54 PM
A new build?  Yay!  :D



Title: Re: Success ** Dontiq - FINISHED!
Post by: Drewid on August 08, 2009, 05:41:41 PM
Yay II