Bongofish

Screen Tablet malarky => Heyaaaalpppp => Topic started by: axel9546 on June 09, 2017, 02:54:05 PM



Title: Laptop screen to wacom cintiqfor drawing
Post by: axel9546 on June 09, 2017, 02:54:05 PM
Hello guys! I woiuld like to build for myself a little screen where i can draw on it. Currently i have a screen from the laptop that i do not use. Model N LP156WF6 SP B1. This is a non touchscreen panel. (im a noob at this stage but im good to assembly computers, so i know a little thing of hw parts). What i have to buy in order to make my screen as a Cintiq? I have to buy another screen that has yet a touchscreen module or i can do buying some parts? Sorry for thoose noob questions but i dont knwo the structure and the funcionalty of a Wacom screen >)


Title: Re: Laptop screen to wacom cintiqfor drawing
Post by: axel9546 on June 09, 2017, 02:54:43 PM
Sorry but i could not make a topic but only a poll


Title: Re: Laptop screen to wacom cintiqfor drawing
Post by: DaBotz on June 10, 2017, 12:24:29 AM
A touchscreen and a digitizer-monitor are not the same... modern Cintiqs may have a touch screen, but it is an add on (and not all users enjoy it, as it sometimes interfere with drawing, like issues with spotty palm rejection in left hand mode creeping in in some driver revisions, strokes activating gestures etc) to the basic digitizer activity.

Most DIY project here have no touch interface (one would need to write a mouse filter driver that mutes the touch mouse on pen's detection, at the very minimum).

You'll need a controller for the pane (which has almost no metal in the active area, so you can decide to skip the panel modding phase)l, and a suitable digitizer (graphic tablet.)

15:6 full HD, the tablets that comes nearer are the Wacom Intuos 4, intuyos 5 and intuos pro  large. Alas, these are 8 x 12.8 ", so they are some 80 pixels narrower han your screen.

>As your panel is just 3.2 mm thick and has no metal plate, once you have a controller and have it up and running, ypu can simply lay it over the tablet and see how it goes.

If you feel very adventurous, you can try with the Huion 1410 Gianos - it is 14" x 10 ", and I think it is the digitizer that Huion uses in their 15.6" full HD "Cintiq Knockoff".

It is some 150 $, though.



Title: Re: Laptop screen to wacom cintiqfor drawing
Post by: axel9546 on June 10, 2017, 07:20:17 AM
A touchscreen and a digitizer-monitor are not the same... modern Cintiqs may have a touch screen, but it is an add on (and not all users enjoy it, as it sometimes interfere with drawing, like issues with spotty palm rejection in left hand mode creeping in in some driver revisions, strokes activating gestures etc) to the basic digitizer activity.

Most DIY project here have no touch interface (one would need to write a mouse filter driver that mutes the touch mouse on pen's detection, at the very minimum).

You'll need a controller for the pane (which has almost no metal in the active area, so you can decide to skip the panel modding phase)l, and a suitable digitizer (graphic tablet.)

15:6 full HD, the tablets that comes nearer are the Wacom Intuos 4, intuyos 5 and intuos pro  large. Alas, these are 8 x 12.8 ", so they are some 80 pixels narrower han your screen.

>As your panel is just 3.2 mm thick and has no metal plate, once you have a controller and have it up and running, ypu can simply lay it over the tablet and see how it goes.

If you feel very adventurous, you can try with the Huion 1410 Gianos - it is 14" x 10 ", and I think it is the digitizer that Huion uses in their 15.6" full HD "Cintiq Knockoff".

It is some 150 $, though.


Wow Thanks for the info. So i dont need a touch panel to let those things work.
What let the Pen working its that Green circuit board ??
Anyway i would not buy the graphics tablet its so necessary? Or i can Just buy a screen with a wacom digotizer included like this for example ?  http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/252974112719
So If i understood i have to put the Green wacom board for first, then put my LCD above and It should work? So i need
1 A screen (that already i have)
2 A wacom Green circuit board
3 A controller for the screen

Am i wrong or good? Sorry i Just need to know about the mecanishm how It works :)

PS: So After i building all' good, It Will bè pressure sensitive like 2048 levels or not?

this is the panel that i have i put some photos https://ibb.co/gpqMtF
https://ibb.co/jRfbSa
https://ibb.co/e1tVna
https://ibb.co/k4K37a


Title: Re: Laptop screen to wacom cintiqfor drawing
Post by: XDjackieXD on June 10, 2017, 02:23:33 PM
The pressure sensitivity is defined by the wacom board and pen used (so if you use a screen with digitizer like the one you linked, you will only have the amount of pressure levels that the wacom penabled tech gives you which were 512 levels iirc).


Title: Re: Laptop screen to wacom cintiqfor drawing
Post by: axel9546 on June 10, 2017, 02:40:51 PM
The pressure sensitivity is defined by the wacom board and pen used (so if you use a screen with digitizer like the one you linked, you will only have the amount of pressure levels that the wacom penabled tech gives you which were 512 levels iirc).
Okay nice to hear this! :)
Ok so what i need its a not too much big tablet where to draw.
Im seeing some specs about Intuos 4 and 5 and what i saw is that some of they call about "Active area" .
For example the Intuos 5 medium has a size of 37.9 x 25.1  cm and an Active area of 22.3 x 13.9 cm. I do not understand, this mean when i Will open the tablet to fit my 15.4 screen, i Will found an area of 22.3 x 13.9 to draw, or i can draw on all' the size dimension?
I mean is the Active area size, the same as the Green wacom digitizer that i Will find in the tablet ?? Or the Green electromagnetic digitizer is bigger(like all' size dimension)? Thanks! :) So i know what panel to use
PS i found this but as i wrote i dont know If i can use all' the size of the tablet or just the "more Black area" to drawGuardalo su eBay http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/263013637103


Title: Re: Laptop screen to wacom cintiqfor drawing
Post by: Ertew on June 10, 2017, 05:03:29 PM
The pressure sensitivity is defined by the wacom board and pen used (so if you use a screen with digitizer like the one you linked, you will only have the amount of pressure levels that the wacom penabled tech gives you which were 512 levels iirc).
Okay nice to hear this! :)
I agree with this. "Artistic" tablets (intuos, cintiq, etc.) have typically 1k or 2k pressure resolution. "Embedded" tablets (digitizer hidden behind laptop/tablet screen, maybe the "signature pad" too) have typically 255 or 511 levels. There are more differences between artistic and embedded tablets.

Im seeing some specs about Intuos 4 and 5 and what i saw is that some of they call about "Active area" .
For example the Intuos 5 medium has a size of 37.9 x 25.1  cm and an Active area of 22.3 x 13.9 cm. I do not understand, this mean when i Will open the tablet to fit my 15.4 screen, i Will found an area of 22.3 x 13.9 to draw, or i can draw on all' the size dimension?
Look at Your monitor. Active area can display image. Screen size are the diagonal of active area, but dimensions include plastic frame around screen. There are two reasons why inactive area are so big. First: it's more comfortable if You have large supporting area - palm rest. Or in reverse, if You use part of tablet as palm rest, You never use it for drawing - active area can be smaller. More about second reason below.

I mean is the Active area size, the same as the Green wacom digitizer that i Will find in the tablet ?? Or the Green electromagnetic digitizer is bigger(like all' size dimension)? Thanks! :) So i know what panel to use
PS i found this but as i wrote i dont know If i can use all' the size of the tablet or just the "more Black area" to drawGuardalo su eBay http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/263013637103
Linked tablet are typical artistic tablet.

EMR tablet are made of two main components (tree if include active battery-less pen). First are electronic components that do the magic, second are antennas that communicate with pen and can determinate it's position.
Embedded tablets have these two separated. You can see thin sheet of plastic with funny grid on it - that are the antennas on flex PCB. Antennas are about the same size as LCD glass. Where are located electronic components? On separated PCB, connected to antennas part. P.S. Do nit separate these two parts. You will
Artistic tablets have only one PCB. Antennas are in the middle, electronic components are located around antennas. That are the second reason why artistic tablets have dimensions mush bigger that active area.
I cannot search photos now. Hope You understand that explanations.


Title: Re: Laptop screen to wacom cintiqfor drawing
Post by: axel9546 on June 10, 2017, 07:45:35 PM
The pressure sensitivity is defined by the wacom board and pen used (so if you use a screen with digitizer like the one you linked, you will only have the amount of pressure levels that the wacom penabled tech gives you which were 512 levels iirc).
Okay nice to hear this! :)
I agree with this. "Artistic" tablets (intuos, cintiq, etc.) have typically 1k or 2k pressure resolution. "Embedded" tablets (digitizer hidden behind laptop/tablet screen, maybe the "signature pad" too) have typically 255 or 511 levels. There are more differences between artistic and embedded tablets.

Im seeing some specs about Intuos 4 and 5 and what i saw is that some of they call about "Active area" .
For example the Intuos 5 medium has a size of 37.9 x 25.1  cm and an Active area of 22.3 x 13.9 cm. I do not understand, this mean when i Will open the tablet to fit my 15.4 screen, i Will found an area of 22.3 x 13.9 to draw, or i can draw on all' the size dimension?
Look at Your monitor. Active area can display image. Screen size are the diagonal of active area, but dimensions include plastic frame around screen. There are two reasons why inactive area are so big. First: it's more comfortable if You have large supporting area - palm rest. Or in reverse, if You use part of tablet as palm rest, You never use it for drawing - active area can be smaller. More about second reason below.

I mean is the Active area size, the same as the Green wacom digitizer that i Will find in the tablet ?? Or the Green electromagnetic digitizer is bigger(like all' size dimension)? Thanks! :) So i know what panel to use
PS i found this but as i wrote i dont know If i can use all' the size of the tablet or just the "more Black area" to drawGuardalo su eBay http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/263013637103
Linked tablet are typical artistic tablet.

EMR tablet are made of two main components (tree if include active battery-less pen). First are electronic components that do the magic, second are antennas that communicate with pen and can determinate it's position.
Embedded tablets have these two separated. You can see thin sheet of plastic with funny grid on it - that are the antennas on flex PCB. Antennas are about the same size as LCD glass. Where are located electronic components? On separated PCB, connected to antennas part. P.S. Do nit separate these two parts. You will
Artistic tablets have only one PCB. Antennas are in the middle, electronic components are located around antennas. That are the second reason why artistic tablets have dimensions mush bigger that active area.
I cannot search photos now. Hope You understand that explanations.
Thanks  Very Thanks.

I Just would like to know If i can maximize the tablet dimension. I exlain.
I would like to put a 13inch screen into the Intuos 5 medium. As i saw i can put it in the tablet cause the screen fit really well and i would use agood area to draw. But i dont know If i can put only a screen large like the Active area is large. For example If i have an Active area of 12"" i can put a 12"" only or i could put a bigger screen also???


Title: Re: Laptop screen to wacom cintiqfor drawing
Post by: XDjackieXD on June 11, 2017, 08:14:23 PM
You can put a larger screen on top of it but the pen will only work inside the active area and calibrating it will be pretty annoying.


Title: Re: Laptop screen to wacom cintiqfor drawing
Post by: axel9546 on June 11, 2017, 08:36:59 PM
You can put a larger screen on top of it but the pen will only work inside the active area and calibrating it will be pretty annoying.
so this mean only Active area Will work with the Pen or i could have the possibility to get work the full Black area?


Title: Re: Laptop screen to wacom cintiqfor drawing
Post by: XDjackieXD on June 11, 2017, 11:55:55 PM
so this mean only Active area Will work with the Pen or i could have the possibility to get work the full Black area?
Your pen will work everywhere it did work without the screen in between.


Title: Re: Laptop screen to wacom cintiqfor drawing
Post by: axel9546 on June 12, 2017, 06:50:29 AM
so i can buy a Intuos 5 medium and fit my 15.6 screen??
This is what i mean :)
(https://image.ibb.co/eYY1DF/1497246766985_503111184.jpg) (https://imgbb.com/) Ofc i have to remove plastic


Title: Re: Laptop screen to wacom cintiqfor drawing
Post by: XDjackieXD on June 12, 2017, 10:17:49 AM
the active area (at least on my intuos 3) is the area that is dark gray on your image. idk what the white marks are for but they are not the hard marks where the active area ends but on the intuos pen end touch my brother got, the active area is a bit bigger than the marks but doesn't extend all the way to the edge of the tablet.
I can't really say anything about the intuos 5 but I'd guess that the active area (aka the area where the pen works) is a bit bigger than the markings but not the whole dark gray area and definitely not the (light-gray) case.


Title: Re: Laptop screen to wacom cintiqfor drawing
Post by: axel9546 on June 12, 2017, 05:11:58 PM
the active area (at least on my intuos 3) is the area that is dark gray on your image. idk what the white marks are for but they are not the hard marks where the active area ends but on the intuos pen end touch my brother got, the active area is a bit bigger than the marks but doesn't extend all the way to the edge of the tablet.
I can't really say anything about the intuos 5 but I'd guess that the active area (aka the area where the pen works) is a bit bigger than the markings but not the whole dark gray area and definitely not the (light-gray) case.

Okay Perfect  Today in gonna get a Intuos 4 large 100€ , then guys what do i need ?? The board for the LCD? Do u have some ideas :) ?


Title: Re: Laptop screen to wacom cintiqfor drawing
Post by: XDjackieXD on June 12, 2017, 11:00:03 PM
You will need an LVDS converter board for your screen. you can find these for your screen on ebay. if you can't find one specifically for your display, you can write a message to one of the sellers with your screen part number and ask if they support it.


Title: Re: Laptop screen to wacom cintiqfor drawing
Post by: axel9546 on June 13, 2017, 10:24:45 AM
You will need an LVDS converter board for your screen. you can find these for your screen on ebay. if you can't find one specifically for your display, you can write a message to one of the sellers with your screen part number and ask if they support it.
They Say this One Will bè good http://www.ebay.com/itm/371480671313
Anyway i talk with some Sellers. They Say me the same things but the Cool fact is that the seller that ship fast has the board at 45€ when a chinese seller has It to 15€ .. Can u see the difference? Me no
Italian Seller http://www.ebay.it/itm/HDMI-VGA-AUDIO-LCD-CONTROLLER-BOARD-for-11-6-13-3-14-15-6-1920X1080-eDP-LCD-/252989289411?hash=item3ae75633c3
Chinese Sellers http://www.ebay.com/itm/112418136020
- http://www.ebay.com/itm/112317669216

What do You think? They Say the same things "Yes i can program the board for your display"
Also the boards doesnt include the Power adapter lol



Title: Re: Laptop screen to wacom cintiqfor drawing
Post by: Pesho on June 13, 2017, 10:44:01 PM
The difference is in the chip they use - some have the Realtek RTD2660 chip, others have a VST29 which i haven't of and the third use the Novatek NT68676 found in some njytouch controllers. All of them will probably work fine.


Title: Re: Laptop screen to wacom cintiqfor drawing
Post by: axel9546 on June 14, 2017, 07:06:13 AM
The difference is in the chip they use - some have the Realtek RTD2660 chip, others have a VST29 which i haven't of and the third use the Novatek NT68676 found in some njytouch controllers. All of them will probably work fine.
im gonna buy the italian One with all' kit It Will bè 70€ :o


Title: Re: Laptop screen to wacom cintiqfor drawing
Post by: Pesho on June 14, 2017, 02:57:53 PM
The difference is in the chip they use - some have the Realtek RTD2660 chip, others have a VST29 which i haven't of and the third use the Novatek NT68676 found in some njytouch controllers. All of them will probably work fine.
im gonna buy the italian One with all' kit It Will bè 70€ :o

I've had success with this one - https://www.aliexpress.com/item/HDMI-LVDS-Controller-Board-40-Pins-Lvds-Cable-Kits-for-Raspberry-PI-3-LP156WH2-TLA1-TLE11366/32645792288.html

It gets hot at the 12V to 5V regulator but other than that it works ok. Check what's available on Aliexpress - often stuff is cheaper than eBay, and the controllers all come from the same chinese manufacturers. If you're willing to wait that is.


Title: Re: Laptop screen to wacom cintiqfor drawing
Post by: axel9546 on June 15, 2017, 11:07:29 AM
The difference is in the chip they use - some have the Realtek RTD2660 chip, others have a VST29 which i haven't of and the third use the Novatek NT68676 found in some njytouch controllers. All of them will probably work fine.
im gonna buy the italian One with all' kit It Will bè 70€ :o

I've had success with this one - https://www.aliexpress.com/item/HDMI-LVDS-Controller-Board-40-Pins-Lvds-Cable-Kits-for-Raspberry-PI-3-LP156WH2-TLA1-TLE11366/32645792288.html

It gets hot at the 12V to 5V regulator but other than that it works ok. Check what's available on Aliexpress - often stuff is cheaper than eBay, and the controllers all come from the same chinese manufacturers. If you're willing to wait that is.
Okay i have the intuos 4 large and the controller from italian seller!!
What i have to do right now? Do you know how to disassembly the intuos 4? I serached on YT but couldnot find nothing


Title: Re: Laptop screen to wacom cintiqfor drawing
Post by: DaBotz on June 15, 2017, 01:36:55 PM
If the panel is thin enough, you may not have to disassemble the intuos at all...

I used a build, for a year or so, which was simply a laptop panel with a 2 mm thick glass cover, simply laid above an untouched Intuos4 large.

(It was based on DonShole's TabletMod enclosure specifications - you can find some hints either on the tabletmod site, or on the Ponoko Market page that sells the designs - for laser cut).


I still had some 5 mm of "free air" - only issues, the panel is dim, has narrow viewing angles and lacks colour saturation and contrast.

So, I'd say, strip the panel, place it above the tablet, and see how it goes (note, usually it is a good idea to connect the ground points of the panel with the back plate of the Intuos but, in alternative, one can simply connect it to the USB Gnd line... as the I$ has miniUSB sockets, you can simply  modify a 3$ cable)...

You can always dismantle the Intuos4 (which has its share of advanced features, like those OLED displays and the Touch Ring - a bit finicky, that ) later.

 


Title: Re: Laptop screen to wacom cintiqfor drawing
Post by: axel9546 on June 15, 2017, 06:29:19 PM
If the panel is thin enough, you may not have to disassemble the intuos at all...

I used a build, for a year or so, which was simply a laptop panel with a 2 mm thick glass cover, simply laid above an untouched Intuos4 large.

(It was based on DonShole's TabletMod enclosure specifications - you can find some hints either on the tabletmod site, or on the Ponoko Market page that sells the designs - for laser cut).


I still had some 5 mm of "free air" - only issues, the panel is dim, has narrow viewing angles and lacks colour saturation and contrast.

So, I'd say, strip the panel, place it above the tablet, and see how it goes (note, usually it is a good idea to connect the ground points of the panel with the back plate of the Intuos but, in alternative, one can simply connect it to the USB Gnd line... as the I$ has miniUSB sockets, you can simply  modify a 3$ cable)...

You can always dismantle the Intuos4 (which has its share of advanced features, like those OLED displays and the Touch Ring - a bit finicky, that ) later.

 
Okay i Will update with the results. Anyway in still really noob at choosing a protector for the actually screen. What screen protector or what i have to buy to put It by the screen and the Pen to not scratch my fragile 15inch panel??
And i dont know how to strip my panel, what this mean?


Title: Re: Laptop screen to wacom cintiqfor drawing
Post by: Ertew on June 16, 2017, 03:09:03 PM
For VIDEO to LVDS converter (for LCD panel) I recommend TSUMv29 or TSUMv59 or cheap VGA-only converters like this: >Aliexpress< (https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Universal-Programmed-23-Firmwares-VGA-to-LVDS-Driver-Controller-Board-DIY-Kit-for-Raspberry-PI-3/32652810223.html).
Main difference between TSUMv chips are:
- old v29 - resolution selected via jumpers or uploaded via VGA connector by seller.
- new v29 - USB for firmware update (each file for each resolution).
- v39 - same as new v29 but support music and photos from USB.
- v59 - same as v39 but also can play movies.
- v56 - newest alternative for discontinued v59, should work the same way as older one.

Main question: what is Your LCD model and do You have anything more for panel? For example LED backlight should work with internal driver, for CCFL backlight You need external driver saved from laptop or bought separately. Number of CCFL tubes matter, driver for 2 tubes won't work with single tube. Next - cable and connectors. It's better to buy special cable (often cost more than 10$) rather than play on Your own and destroy something.

Okay i Will update with the results. Anyway in still really noob at choosing a protector for the actually screen. What screen protector or what i have to buy to put It by the screen and the Pen to not scratch my fragile 15inch panel??
And i dont know how to strip my panel, what this mean?

For short test LCD panel can work without anything protective on top. Pen with good nib shouldn't scratch screen.
For regular usage scratches wasn't a problem. Real problems are: pressure (both from pen and hand) and removing dirt (water can flow into panel frame then corrosion will destroy something). Thus You need to add protective sheet of glass or transparent plastic and some spacing between plastic and LCD because plastic (plexi/PMMA/lexan/...) will bend when pressed.
Plus, please carefully select material. Some types have high friction, drawing on that wouldn't be as nice as on other types.

LCD panel are made of 2-layer glass (with polarizer, color filters, ...), light source (CCFL/LED strip), backlight diffuser, sheets of diffusers/lenses/..., electronic board (with connector for signal input), drivers mounted on flat flex and metal frame.
Because Wacom works with EMR (electromagnetic) technology, electronic board and metal frame will block signal or cause interferences (search this forum for jitter). Tablet need to remove that parts but LCD wouldn't work without PCB. Only solution are to remove metal frame (strip panel) and gently twist PCB by 180*. In some cases PCB need extra shielding to reduce jitter but that's not my specialization. I prefer to get screen from TabletPC with integrated digitizer, then add two converters and simple case.


EDIT:
My build - TabletPC screen, converters for digitizer and LCD: http://forum.bongofish.co.uk/index.php?topic=2562.msg21888#msg21888
How to strip LCD monitor, then panel: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KrwHgTrxpnk


Title: Re: Laptop screen to wacom cintiqfor drawing
Post by: axel9546 on June 16, 2017, 07:47:33 PM
For VIDEO to LVDS converter (for LCD panel) I recommend TSUMv29 or TSUMv59 or cheap VGA-only converters like this: >Aliexpress< (https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Universal-Programmed-23-Firmwares-VGA-to-LVDS-Driver-Controller-Board-DIY-Kit-for-Raspberry-PI-3/32652810223.html).
Main difference between TSUMv chips are:
- old v29 - resolution selected via jumpers or uploaded via VGA connector by seller.
- new v29 - USB for firmware update (each file for each resolution).
- v39 - same as new v29 but support music and photos from USB.
- v59 - same as v39 but also can play movies.
- v56 - newest alternative for discontinued v59, should work the same way as older one.

Main question: what is Your LCD model and do You have anything more for panel? For example LED backlight should work with internal driver, for CCFL backlight You need external driver saved from laptop or bought separately. Number of CCFL tubes matter, driver for 2 tubes won't work with single tube. Next - cable and connectors. It's better to buy special cable (often cost more than 10$) rather than play on Your own and destroy something.

Okay i Will update with the results. Anyway in still really noob at choosing a protector for the actually screen. What screen protector or what i have to buy to put It by the screen and the Pen to not scratch my fragile 15inch panel??
And i dont know how to strip my panel, what this mean?

For short test LCD panel can work without anything protective on top. Pen with good nib shouldn't scratch screen.
For regular usage scratches wasn't a problem. Real problems are: pressure (both from pen and hand) and removing dirt (water can flow into panel frame then corrosion will destroy something). Thus You need to add protective sheet of glass or transparent plastic and some spacing between plastic and LCD because plastic (plexi/PMMA/lexan/...) will bend when pressed.
Plus, please carefully select material. Some types have high friction, drawing on that wouldn't be as nice as on other types.

LCD panel are made of 2-layer glass (with polarizer, color filters, ...), light source (CCFL/LED strip), backlight diffuser, sheets of diffusers/lenses/..., electronic board (with connector for signal input), drivers mounted on flat flex and metal frame.
Because Wacom works with EMR (electromagnetic) technology, electronic board and metal frame will block signal or cause interferences (search this forum for jitter). Tablet need to remove that parts but LCD wouldn't work without PCB. Only solution are to remove metal frame (strip panel) and gently twist PCB by 180*. In some cases PCB need extra shielding to reduce jitter but that's not my specialization. I prefer to get screen from TabletPC with integrated digitizer, then add two converters and simple case.


EDIT:
My build - TabletPC screen, converters for digitizer and LCD: http://forum.bongofish.co.uk/index.php?topic=2562.msg21888#msg21888
How to strip LCD monitor, then panel: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KrwHgTrxpnk
Thanks
I have an lp156wf6spb1 and i have this thing http://www.ebay.it/itm/HDMI-VGA-AUDIO-LCD-CONTROLLER-BOARD-for-11-6-13-3-14-15-6-1920X1080-eDP-LCD-/252989289411?hash=item3ae75633c3
What i have to do its Just to connect the edp cable and Power and HDMI , It Will work?? Or i have to connect other things.
The panel that i have have this composition. Where i start to remove the metal? Aldo u Can see the Intuos 4 large . What Can i put between the Green board and the screen when i Will put the screen to that? A plastic plexiglass 1mm frame?
(https://thumb.ibb.co/ga2Xq5/IMG_20170616_204222.jpg) (https://ibb.co/ga2Xq5) (https://thumb.ibb.co/db2nOQ/IMG_20170616_204232.jpg) (https://ibb.co/db2nOQ) (https://thumb.ibb.co/f52bHk/IMG_20170616_204244.jpg) (https://ibb.co/f52bHk) (https://thumb.ibb.co/dwFkA5/IMG_20170616_204247.jpg) (https://ibb.co/dwFkA5) (https://thumb.ibb.co/nav7OQ/IMG_20170616_204252.jpg) (https://ibb.co/nav7OQ) (https://thumb.ibb.co/jp1QA5/IMG_20170616_204257.jpg) (https://ibb.co/jp1QA5) (https://thumb.ibb.co/b8kVck/IMG_20170616_204314.jpg) (https://ibb.co/b8kVck)


Title: Re: Laptop screen to wacom cintiqfor drawing
Post by: Ertew on June 16, 2017, 10:45:33 PM
Oh, You have eDP interface. That changes a lot (no LVDS). LCD and controller should work. I cannot see cable that fits both LCD and converter. Hope You have it too.

First stack LCD on Wacom and test if it working. Pen should working without problems when LCD is OFF. When LCD is ON there shouldn't be much jitter in center of screen. Metal should affect Wacom only at edges and corners. If You have problems at center too - You may need to swap LCD screen to different model.

How to remove metal: You need to remove whole black tape and few white pieces from screen. Then unscrew PCB (green part in panel) and try to remove metal without damaging flexible connectors. Metal should be held in place by plastic latches, sometimes glue.

Without metal, bottom part of screen will contain only: PCB, LED strip, white sheet (light reflecting material) and plastic frame.
You need to insulate PCB and LED strip from contact with Wacom. 1mm plexi or kapton tape are great decision. 2-3 layers of adhesive plastic tape are OK.
Other components (most of screen) are already made of plastic thus not need extra insulation.

P.S. Part of metal frame may act as heatsink for LED strip. You should check temperature with and without metal. Overheated LEDs will burn quickly.


Title: Re: Laptop screen to wacom cintiqfor drawing
Post by: axel9546 on June 17, 2017, 08:52:34 AM
Oh, You have eDP interface. That changes a lot (no LVDS). LCD and controller should work. I cannot see cable that fits both LCD and converter. Hope You have it too.

First stack LCD on Wacom and test if it working. Pen should working without problems when LCD is OFF. When LCD is ON there shouldn't be much jitter in center of screen. Metal should affect Wacom only at edges and corners. If You have problems at center too - You may need to swap LCD screen to different model.

How to remove metal: You need to remove whole black tape and few white pieces from screen. Then unscrew PCB (green part in panel) and try to remove metal without damaging flexible connectors. Metal should be held in place by plastic latches, sometimes glue.

Without metal, bottom part of screen will contain only: PCB, LED strip, white sheet (light reflecting material) and plastic frame.
You need to insulate PCB and LED strip from contact with Wacom. 1mm plexi or kapton tape are great decision. 2-3 layers of adhesive plastic tape are OK.
Other components (most of screen) are already made of plastic thus not need extra insulation.

P.S. Part of metal frame may act as heatsink for LED strip. You should check temperature with and without metal. Overheated LEDs will burn quickly.
I dont know very much to disassembly LCD panel. Im good to do it with laptop or desktop PC but with panel idk
I would like to know , how i can check the temperature for the panel?? I had idea to put 1mm plexi between screen and wacom Green board .. It work :) so i keep It?
If u have video tutorial for stripping the panel for the wacom ill bè Glad :)


Title: Re: Laptop screen to wacom cintiqfor drawing
Post by: Ertew on June 17, 2017, 09:57:42 AM
So Wacom works. That's great.
1mm plexi is 1mm wasted space. You need to add 2-3mm top layer (glass/plexi) and let say 1mm gap between LCD and top layer. If Wacom works with extra few mm then You can keep 1mm plexi. If Wacom not work because of distance You need to reduce thickness and probably replace 1mm plexi with something thinner. Hope You understand.

I can't show You the process of disassembling LCD panel. I can only search for that on YT and link You video.
Here You can seen black tape around LCD and how to remove it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DKokN0h94UI
Here how to deal with latches connecting metal and plastic: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lrN3E-TIrLU
In both cases LCD projector need to keep only glass part and flex connections. You need to keep backlight unit and plastic frame too.


Title: Re: Laptop screen to wacom cintiqfor drawing
Post by: axel9546 on June 17, 2017, 11:04:29 AM
So Wacom works. That's great.
1mm plexi is 1mm wasted space. You need to add 2-3mm top layer (glass/plexi) and let say 1mm gap between LCD and top layer. If Wacom works with extra few mm then You can keep 1mm plexi. If Wacom not work because of distance You need to reduce thickness and probably replace 1mm plexi with something thinner. Hope You understand.

I can't show You the process of disassembling LCD panel. I can only search for that on YT and link You video.
Here You can seen black tape around LCD and how to remove it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DKokN0h94UI
Here how to deal with latches connecting metal and plastic: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lrN3E-TIrLU
In both cases LCD projector need to keep only glass part and flex connections. You need to keep backlight unit and plastic frame too.
Wow Thanks  
So basically i disassembly the tape and the metal out of the screen then i try to straight the Little Green board and then? I still have to remove something?
Okay so i have to put something above the screen. I was thinking about an ultra thin glass flexible, but It Will have to bè the clearest thing in the world, or i could have problem whatching the screen colors or the reflex Will hurt my eyes. Do u have some idea for the material?
Also.. Can i just attach and put the LCD Screen to the Green Wacom Tablet thing? Or it will burn when the screen gets hot, so i have to put a distance in betweeen?


Title: Re: Laptop screen to wacom cintiqfor drawing
Post by: Ertew on June 17, 2017, 04:36:17 PM
I looked one more time at Your photos and noticed that You have strange type of screen.
Normal screen are designed to have small frame but great thickness. That type have PCB folded behind screen.
You have different type of screen designed to be thin but much bigger than active area. You already have PCB located at side of screen and not need to straight the flexible connectors.
I not have experience with that type of screen and cannot help You this time. Sorry.

LCD panel doesn't generate as much heat as You think. That amount of heat cannot burn electronic components inside screen or tablet. Yes You can stack screen on top of Wacom and don't worry about Wacom. There are only two components extra sensitive to heat: liquid crystals inside display and LEDs.
LEDs have designed live time about 30k hours at 30*C (data for regular LED, backlight strip may have different parameters) but live time will drop significantly as temperature increases. To reduce temperature You can keep part of frame near backlight strip or reduce backlight power by PWM dimming (if supported by HDMI converter).
Liquid crystals will refuse to work above certain temperature. As result image will disappear, but reappear when you cooled the screen. If You see that effect at edge of LCD - You almost killed LED backlight.


Title: Re: Laptop screen to wacom cintiqfor drawing
Post by: axel9546 on June 17, 2017, 06:00:15 PM
I looked one more time at Your photos and noticed that You have strange type of screen.
Normal screen are designed to have small frame but great thickness. That type have PCB folded behind screen.
You have different type of screen designed to be thin but much bigger than active area. You already have PCB located at side of screen and not need to straight the flexible connectors.
I not have experience with that type of screen and cannot help You this time. Sorry.

LCD panel doesn't generate as much heat as You think. That amount of heat cannot burn electronic components inside screen or tablet. Yes You can stack screen on top of Wacom and don't worry about Wacom. There are only two components extra sensitive to heat: liquid crystals inside display and LEDs.
LEDs have designed live time about 30k hours at 30*C (data for regular LED, backlight strip may have different parameters) but live time will drop significantly as temperature increases. To reduce temperature You can keep part of frame near backlight strip or reduce backlight power by PWM dimming (if supported by HDMI converter).
Liquid crystals will refuse to work above certain temperature. As result image will disappear, but reappear when you cooled the screen. If You see that effect at edge of LCD - You almost killed LED backlight.
Okay!! This is nice Thanks
So i can Just attach the screen with some alluminium tape directly to the wacom?
Look at the Image and tell me If this is okay or wrong :)
(https://thumb.ibb.co/bLX8yQ/IMG_20170617_185718.jpg) (https://ibb.co/bLX8yQ) (https://thumb.ibb.co/bs4oyQ/IMG_20170617_185722.jpg) (https://ibb.co/bs4oyQ) (https://thumb.ibb.co/nbavdQ/IMG_20170617_185342.jpg) (https://ibb.co/nbavdQ)
Then i can do the same and tape the Little board of the screen too , to the wacom?
What glass i can put above all? Maybe a strong think?


Title: Re: Laptop screen to wacom cintiqfor drawing
Post by: Ertew on June 17, 2017, 06:43:47 PM
Real aluminium tape may cause short circuit and destroy Wacom. I prefer to use different type of tape especially "duck tape" - plastic thing but reinforced.

Front cover have two aspects. First is base material. Glass may be fragile but 2mm layer should be enough for drawing. Plexi are elastic and may bend enough to put pressure to LCD surface but it's easier to cut. 3mm may be enough but I'm not sure. Second thing are just top layer. This layer determines scratch resistance, dirt resistance and friction for pen.
I recommend You to use glass and put protective sticker on top - to reduce pen friction. But again I have only experience based on two tablet-PC screens and few things that I try to put on top of it to cover deep scratches. Based on my experience, scratched surface of tablet screen are the best thing I can found. Bare glass and few plastic things have much higher friction than original tablet surface. So You need to test it all on Your own.


Title: Re: Laptop screen to wacom cintiqfor drawing
Post by: axel9546 on June 17, 2017, 07:25:38 PM
Real aluminium tape may cause short circuit and destroy Wacom. I prefer to use different type of tape especially "duck tape" - plastic thing but reinforced.

Front cover have two aspects. First is base material. Glass may be fragile but 2mm layer should be enough for drawing. Plexi are elastic and may bend enough to put pressure to LCD surface but it's easier to cut. 3mm may be enough but I'm not sure. Second thing are just top layer. This layer determines scratch resistance, dirt resistance and friction for pen.
I recommend You to use glass and put protective sticker on top - to reduce pen friction. But again I have only experience based on two tablet-PC screens and few things that I try to put on top of it to cover deep scratches. Based on my experience, scratched surface of tablet screen are the best thing I can found. Bare glass and few plastic things have much higher friction than original tablet surface. So You need to test it all on Your own.
Okay
About the alluminium tape .. Which One i have to buy or wich tape is the best to take the screen hold on securely in the wacom board and get no interferenze?


Title: Re: Laptop screen to wacom cintiqfor drawing
Post by: DaBotz on June 18, 2017, 08:15:28 PM
Aluminium (or copper) tape, is used most often to  try and build some RF shielding in LCD-Over-Intuos builds, more than anything else. In that use, anyway, it is often a good idea to use it to enclose some non-conductive plastic bag (or some construction akin to it).

A Ertew says, to fix things  non-conductive normal - or double sided - duct tape is better.


Title: Re: Laptop screen to wacom cintiqfor drawing
Post by: axel9546 on June 19, 2017, 02:22:58 PM
Aluminium (or copper) tape, is used most often to  try and build some RF shielding in LCD-Over-Intuos builds, more than anything else. In that use, anyway, it is often a good idea to use it to enclose some non-conductive plastic bag (or some construction akin to it).

A Ertew says, to fix things  non-conductive normal - or double sided - duct tape is better.
Hello so i just put the converter board and connect all.
The pen seem to not follow the cursor in some point, and in all the screen area is not calibrated even if i try to calibrate.
The screen gets really hot. Any ideas??
All' things work well but i have to put something like a fan to Cool the area
(https://thumb.ibb.co/ccpqXk/IMG_20170619_224251.jpg) (https://ibb.co/ccpqXk)
What this mean?


Title: Re: Laptop screen to wacom cintiqfor drawing
Post by: DaBotz on June 19, 2017, 11:20:14 PM
A 15.6" is a 16:9 LCD which is wider than the active area of an Intuos 4 L, yet shorter than it is... it is a particularly complex situation because you need to calibrate the Table AND the projection on the screen.

My biggest builds are in the same situation, so this may help you...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rRXBb_hafAY

To build the thing, you can try to place it so that cursor and pen coincide at the centre, then work on one dimension (for example, height, by reducing the tablet active area), then the other (width, you'll have to reduce the projection on screen), then again on the first...

I suggest to place things so that they touch on the middle is, just to help you getting started.

You may revise the build to leave what little active area is free all on one side (because, if you have a screen that is placed where the projection of that "excess" area is, the pen will be able to reach it) but, as you are getting sizes, let it for after (once you got how to calibrate the build - fist time took me 30 minutes, now I do it in a couple of minutes or so).

I usually leave "all on top" -  I keep a small screen above my main drawing machine, where I leave VLC playing some series... I have enough "excess pen area" to go up and click the controls and the seek bar of VLC at full screen.

The most important thing, anyway, is to have screen and digitizer as parallel as possible...

As for the warmth, it is a common problem...If the screen has the LCD strip on only one side, you may decide to leave it in a position that is less bothering;

The Glass is a less than spectacular heat transmitter, so it may help a little, as it could help having an heat-sink of some kind - a plate touching the LCD at/under/around the LED strip, for example... as heat-sink, a simple tape is probably not enough, and something thicker should be better.

Some people also adds little fans ( a computer fan uses the same 12 V most controller boards eat) in an effort to have an air flux to cool things.

Personally, I do not like the added noise, so I avoid them (though, for my UBiQ 2 it would be  - maybe - better to add one, maybe heat-activated)

The cursor does not follow the pen in some spots... if the pen is lost on a vertical band, it may means that there is an inductive coil in the T-Con board at the bottom of the LCD.

Try to raise (carefully! ) the board a bit away from the Intuos (as the ribbons glued to it  and the LCD are the most delicate thing and impossible to fix, getting it more than a couple of cm away - and 45º inclined on the horizontal - is going to be impossible, but that much may be more than enough) .

If you see improvements, with the board "inclined away", then it is probable that building an RF cage enclosing that board could help things.

In case I suggest to build such cage as wide as the area occupied by the vertical antenna lines (which, by the way, are what measures the horizontal  - x axis -position ), not just enough to enclose the board (which is usually quite some cm less).

(I suspect that the fact I did limit mines just to that is the reason why all my builds - that needed that cage - "fritz" at the two vertical borders... The cage acts as a torus antenna, whose field bend in a emi-sphere at the extremes, and the inclined-horizontal field lines there couples with the vertical antennas, making difficult to read the X-Axis position).


Title: Re: Laptop screen to wacom cintiqfor drawing
Post by: axel9546 on June 19, 2017, 11:28:06 PM
A 15.6" is a 16:9 LCD which is wider thasn the active area, yet shorter than it... it is a particularly complex situation because you need to calibrate the Table AND the proyection on the screen.

My biggest builds are in the same situation, so this may help you...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rRXBb_hafAY

To build the thing, you can try to place it so that cursor and pen coincide at the centre, then work up on one dimension (for example, height, by reducing the tablet active area), then the other (width, you'll have to reduce the projection on screen), then again on the height...

Place things so that they touch on the middle is, just to help you get started.

You may revise the build to leave what little active area is free all on one side (because, if you have a screen that is placed where the projection of that "excess" area is, the pen will be able to reach it) but, as you are getting sizes, let it for after (once you got how to calibrate the build - fist time took me 30 minutes, now I do it in a couple of minutes or so).

I usually leave "all on top" -  I keep a small screen above my main drawing machine, where I leave VLC playing some series... I have enough "excess pen area" to go up and click the controls and the seek bar of VLC at full screen.

 
Okay in trying to do this! :).
Also i have to see If there is some jitter i Will Say u If there is.
The main thing its that the LCD and the converter board gets really hot .. Its normal??


Title: Re: Laptop screen to wacom cintiqfor drawing
Post by: DaBotz on June 20, 2017, 12:22:03 AM
For the LCD, it depends on the kind of modifications you had to do to it to let the pens signal go through.

If you had to eliminate stuff that could act as an heat-sink, it's actual temperature is probably higher than the original (and optimal), so adding an heat-sink for the led strip could be a good idea.

If it is hot the TCon-Board... are you sure the Converter board is supplying the right voltage to the panel?

On the side of the converter board, I  am a bit more dubious... but, then again, I never checked the temperature of the controller boards in my builds (of the 5, three were actual desktop monitors, so compatibility among the various parts was a given).

I never noticed them to get "very hot" - using  thermometer to get a temperature could give some hard facts on which guess - , though.


Title: Re: Laptop screen to wacom cintiqfor drawing
Post by: axel9546 on June 20, 2017, 08:22:09 AM
For the LCD, it depends on the kind of modifications you had to do to it to let the pens signal go through.

If you had to eliminate stuff that could act as an heat-sink, it's actual temperature is probably higher than the original (and optimal), so adding an heat-sink for the led strip could be a good idea.

If it is hot the TCon-Board... are you sure the Converter board is supplying the right voltage to the panel?

On the side of the converter board, I  am a bit more dubious... but, then again, I never checked the temperature of the controller boards in my builds (of the 5, three were actual desktop monitors, so compatibility among the various parts was a given).

I never noticed them to get "very hot" - using  thermometer to get a temperature could give some hard facts on which guess - , though.

Okay i Will try for anche heatsink.Anyway in stuck to calibration. Tried 3h or calibration and Pen at the center of the LCD its okay, but when i move to the right or left, not follow well the Pen


Title: Re: Laptop screen to wacom cintiqfor drawing
Post by: DaBotz on June 21, 2017, 12:51:32 PM
Note... I checked the TCon heats up, on my builds too.

I wouldn't be too worried about it, apart that it becomes a mess to work on them when the weather is warm.


Pens and screen borders is often a bit of a mess... typically, one must accept that the pen will "go away" in the area near the horizontal or vertical border of the tablet.

The best you can do is to calibrate it so that the pen is reasonably accurate in the widest possible area... not being able to go on the borders complicates a tiny bit the calibration.

Check the Simtiq planner   ( https://www.dropbox.com/s/676vr2qyxeuhab2/simtiq_planner.html?dl=1 ) to have an idea of the initial values.

Given the data of your screen, you should reduce the projection on the screen some 60 pixeels for each side (so, left, 60, right 1860) and see how it goes  from there.

(in your case, you have to change the screen projection, not the tablet area, to tune the X axis )





Title: Re: Laptop screen to wacom cintiqfor drawing
Post by: axel9546 on July 20, 2017, 10:11:38 AM
Note... I checked the TCon heats up, on my builds too.

I wouldn't be too worried about it, apart that it becomes a mess to work on them when the weather is warm.


Pens and screen borders is often a bit of a mess... typically, one must accept that the pen will "go away" in the area near the horizontal or vertical border of the tablet.

The best you can do is to calibrate it so that the pen is reasonably accurate in the widest possible area... not being able to go on the borders complicates a tiny bit the calibration.

Check the Simtiq planner   ( https://www.dropbox.com/s/676vr2qyxeuhab2/simtiq_planner.html?dl=1 ) to have an idea of the initial values.

Given the data of your screen, you should reduce the projection on the screen some 60 pixeels for each side (so, left, 60, right 1860) and see how it goes  from there.

(in your case, you have to change the screen projection, not the tablet area, to tune the X axis )




Hello Can u help me? Why when i point the Pen on the screen in some point i have this problem https://streamable.com/j6ksc (its a video)


Title: Re: Laptop screen to wacom cintiqfor drawing
Post by: DaBotz on July 21, 2017, 01:02:40 AM
Is it just a point, or a whole vertical band?

If it is a point, the source of the noise probably is the circuitry inside the LCD, and little can be done aside trying to see if changing the refresh rate does ameliorate it.

If it is a vertical band in which you have horizontal jitter, then the culprit is inside the t-con board (possibly, an inductance - a coil; my last build has one, three cm from the right border of the t-con, and it makes for horrible jitter and false clicks) and you can try to shield it, building an RF cage all around the T-Con board.

(if possible, extends its width so that the margins of the cage lay beyond the limits of the tablet active area... I suspect that where the cage ends, the EM field bends and it "couples" with the digitizer antennas, so going wider could help avoid my meddlesome "vertical border crazies")


Title: Re: Laptop screen to wacom cintiqfor drawing
Post by: jedikalimero on October 26, 2017, 01:58:11 PM
the active area (at least on my intuos 3) is the area that is dark gray on your image. idk what the white marks are for but they are not the hard marks where the active area ends but on the intuos pen end touch my brother got, the active area is a bit bigger than the marks but doesn't extend all the way to the edge of the tablet.
I can't really say anything about the intuos 5 but I'd guess that the active area (aka the area where the pen works) is a bit bigger than the markings but not the whole dark gray area and definitely not the (light-gray) case.


In the Intuos 5 and pro, the White marks (they are really LED lights) define the active area. The pen will not work beyond this area. The Dark grey area is bigger than the active area because this way your pen will not bump when you reach the border of the active area. This was some of a problem in Intuos 4 and older. It is an unpleasant sensation and erodes the nib faster if you frequently reach the borders and bump between the drawing surface and the case.

When placing an LCD screen over the tablet, the pen will still be limited to the active area. It will not extend magically beyond that, of course. There is a calculator somewhere in the forum that allows to compare Intuos models and typical LCD screen sizes and see graphically which one will fit which each other.