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Author Topic: jittering pointer  (Read 69001 times)
bernard
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« Reply #135 on: January 07, 2012, 03:50:29 AM »

Quite a few people tried special materials with high-permeability to shield their builds. I strongly believe that a Faraday cage is not enough for some of the stuff happening in the tablet. That is the reason why I believe (without any proof) that the metal back plane on all Wacoms is not a "common" metal alloy, but something that has special magnetic properties (not sure what exactly though).

That makes me think -- you accidentally bumped that plate 2 times at one point, can you make some tests if this appears to make a difference when passing the pen over that area? I mean, is there an unusual "distortion" in the pen alignment?
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Dragon
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« Reply #136 on: January 07, 2012, 04:05:18 AM »

You mean how I dropped my phone on the 4x5 tablet and left two dents?  I was able to push the dents out from the other side so they didn't leave much distortion in the metal.  I can't identify any change in mouse movement over them (though I'm not sure exactly where they are without opening the tablet, which I don't want to do since the wires were such a pain to get to fit).
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wah
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« Reply #137 on: January 10, 2012, 04:31:59 PM »

Dear friend at bongo, it's my first post. as i experience on my build. i found jitter comes because the pen to far from the tablet, i mean it's because your Lcd panel to tick. on my v.1 i build in layer. Tablet>4mm acrylic>LED Diffuser>LCD>finish on top with 4mm acrylic, to get nice and clean design. the problem jitter appears. then i fix it on second build v.1.2 explain in layer. Tablet>LED Diffuser>LCD>thin film screen guard. and Holla no jitter anymore (sorry for my bad English) i used BENQ LED 15in on my Wacom intuos4 Large. with normal refresh rate 60. so in conclusion..make it as thin and as close as possible to the tablet sensor... Grin
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Adlorem
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« Reply #138 on: January 10, 2012, 06:51:23 PM »

Another method would be increasing pen reading height ... I have read that you can do it by moving metal reflector backplate more then 1cm from the wacom sensor. Is it only rumors or someone really did it?
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bernard
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« Reply #139 on: January 13, 2012, 06:32:02 AM »

increasing reading height by increasing backplate distance. Only one person experienced it (and I do not remember on which wacom board), so we just pass this information along as something to "try". Not a lot of people tried it. Most of the time, the spacing is already "optimal".
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Adlorem
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« Reply #140 on: January 13, 2012, 09:29:02 AM »

Didn't work for me with Wacom3 A3  Undecided
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ciberpol
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« Reply #141 on: February 26, 2012, 08:11:29 PM »

Привет от первых Российских разработчиков Smiley
Использовал Wacom Intuos3 A4 и монитор Rover Optima 151, дрожания не было.
В процессе дальнейшей сборки сломал матрицу, пришлось взять другой монитор Samsung SyncMaster 540B.
Та же проблема что у всех. С этой матрицей дико дрожит курсор.
Пробовал экранировать лампы (сетка пропускающая свет) не помогает.
Если отключить подсветку, экранировать блок питания и другое оборудование - дрожание остается при работающей матрице.
Видимо проблема в частотах развертки и времени отклика.
-----------------------
Greetings from the first Russian developers Smiley
Used Wacom Intuos3 A4 and monitor Rover Optima 151, tremblings weren't.
In the course of the further assembly has broken a matrix, it was necessary to take other monitor of Samsung SyncMaster 540B.
The same problem that at all. With this matrix the cursor wildly shivers.
Tried to screen lamps (the grid passing light) doesn't help.
If to disconnect illumination, to screen power supply unit and other equipment - trembling remains at an operating matrix.
Probably a problem in scanning frequencies and response time.
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ciberpol
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« Reply #142 on: March 11, 2012, 06:07:34 AM »

Hello.
Made Intuos3 A4-SamsungSyncMaster 540B. There was a cursor trembling.
Made the aluminum screen of all details (a lamp of illumination the punched foil).
Everything became excellent.
But in 10-15 minutes of work after inclusion, again there is a trembling of the cursor and air cliques.
With what it is connected?
(I assume it it is connected with illumination lamps)






http://youtu.be/uqzqagE78z0
« Last Edit: March 11, 2012, 06:40:04 AM by ciberpol » Logged
cellofaan
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« Reply #143 on: August 08, 2012, 10:22:31 AM »

So there is no jitter when you have just turned it on, only after using it for a while?
Then the only thing I can think of is indeed the CCFL lights, that heat up.
Maybe the board doesn't respond well to the heat?
You could try to put some insulation between the lamps and the board, a layer of cardboard or several layers of paper might do the trick, or at least extend the time it takes for the board to become hot.
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Aerendraca
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« Reply #144 on: October 25, 2012, 01:37:08 PM »

I have a question regarding jittering. Are people plugging the tablets into desktop PCs or Laptops?

I have my intuos 2 plugged into a laptop, will be trying it in my desktop tonight if I get a chance. The thinking is two fold, first it could be that the current supplied to the tablet from a laptop is relatively low compared with a desktop, meaning that the tablet is not getting as much power and subsequently the strength of the radio signal is not as great. Secondly, it could be that the 0V of the laptop is floating above or below the 0V of the tft screen - especially if the laptop is being powered by battery - and although they are not directly connected there may be a chance of some induced potential difference causing spikes, or perhaps the RF signal from the tablet occationally finds a 'more convenient' route to 0V through the tft which causes drops in signal to the pen which then causes the tablet to lose it's position for a fraction of a second. Once again I have not tested this yet, just chucking out ideas for people to catch. This idea happens to conincide with a problem of grounding that occured at work this morning which got me thinking.
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bernard
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« Reply #145 on: October 25, 2012, 02:24:30 PM »

I have strong doubts (but no proof) about the fact that laptops supposedly cannot delivers ample power (current) and cannot sustain the USB voltage to 5V that the tablet requires. The tablet does not use that much power btw, I measured the power drawn from a few Wacom tablets (but never intuos 3 or newer) and I never saw anything over 150mAmps (talking about the 5 Volts) (it was often well under 100mA, I say 150mA just to be on the safe side).  All USB ports can deliver at least 100mA at minimum.

Now onto the laptop being on powered only on battery and thus "floating" in comparison to its "RF" environment, well, yeah, why not?  To me, RF is sooo weird. You can connect the laptop AC adapter to help remove that "floating". This could lead to an interesting try:  With or without the AC adapter connected: do we see any difference?
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Aerendraca
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« Reply #146 on: October 25, 2012, 05:20:48 PM »

Maybe you're right about the USB power, but what about the cleanliness of the output? Perhaps this differs between computers, maybe more so between desktop and laptops? I know there are regulations for USB2.0 but I think this was not so much the case with USB1.0, maybe some people have their wacoms plugged in USB1.0 sockets - just another thought.

The reason I harp on about this is that I have had devices in the past that did not work on my laptops but worked fine on my desktop. To this day I have no idea why but I know I'm not the only person that this has happened to.
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bernard
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« Reply #147 on: October 25, 2012, 07:56:39 PM »

usb 1.0 delivers 100mA and the device can ask for more. up to 500. The laptop can refuse. In that case, the device won't work. This occurs more often with laptops (compared to desktop).  The device can also eat more current than negotiated. Typical examples is a peak from a HDD motor spinning up. Some host will allow this but others that are tight on power might not tolerate it.

Given the relatively low power consumption of the Wacoms I would not worry too much.

Noisy: yeah that's a possibility. I would imagine Wacom did some filtering on that regard given the nature of the device. There are certainly some RF component going into the power which could be potentially disruptive.
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pntbll248
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« Reply #148 on: February 13, 2013, 01:58:12 AM »

I tried building a composite of several layers of Mu Metal, one layer of Carbon sheet, and three layers of Metglas Ribbon. The composite was placed over the LED strip and TFT circuitry on a LP156WF4. This was basically a high-permeability/moderate saturation material with a radio absorbing sheet and an extremely high permeability/low saturation tape. Everything was grounded to earth ground using an alligator clamp to 3 prong AC (only ground prong active). There was slightly better attenuation over that of 6mil copper tape, but that's likely due to the significantly thicker material. Not worth the price of materials. The controller board was likewise shielded.

What about using an oversized display and simply moving the affected areas of the screen away from the active area of the digitizer? It seems that the TFT circuitry and LED strip is virtually always to blame in the displays that I've tested (CCFL lamps seem to take well to copper-tape-as-Faraday-cage shielding), but the interference degrades quickly with distance. You'd have to deal with unreachable parts of the screen obviously, but that may not be the end of the world. I imagine you could even set custom resolutions and alignment with a program like powerstrip to maintain a native resolution with black borders around the inactive area of the monitor. With a 17" 1920x1200 screen, you could still have high pixel density over the active area with an Intuos4 L.
« Last Edit: February 13, 2013, 02:04:33 AM by pntbll248 » Logged
pntbll248
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« Reply #149 on: March 14, 2013, 12:26:05 AM »

In case anyone is interested, I went over TFT circuitry with a triple axis magnetometer (gaussmeter) and honestly, there's not much to be found in the Extremely Low Frequency band for which high permeability materials will be most helpful. Makes sense, the circuitry should be pretty well manufactured to avoid this. Anyways, Hanvon tablets (also battery-free pens) connect at the 750khz band, I imagine Wacom tablets may fall somewhere in the same range? Anyways, thought it may be a helpful bit of info for whom it may concern.
« Last Edit: March 14, 2013, 01:02:31 AM by pntbll248 » Logged
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