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Author Topic: Waxbee on Windows 10  (Read 1671 times)
ben8763
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« on: May 07, 2016, 12:25:44 AM »

Ok so this is waaaaay out of my knowledge but why not jump in the deep end every now and then? that's how we learn.


I messaged Bernard recently regarding getting Waxbee running on a clone 32u4 board to run on windows 10 and he suggested I post a topic here to enlist some help and for everyone benefit.

Tablet is a UD-1218-r
Board is called a LeoStick: http://www.freetronics.com.au/products/leostick#.Vy0nRIR97IU
32u4 based board and has worked as a simple HID on other projects for me just fine.

I've flashed the Intuos 2 UD1218 (I now know that there are no Intuos 2 drivers for WIN10) hex onto the board using an Arduino Uno as an ISP and it appears to have worked fine. Currently the board is displaying in the device manage as an HID Compliant Digitizer, same thing Windows 8.


It should be noted that I am a complete and utter novice in this area (WHY AM I EVEN TRYING... stubbornness) so any advice/help will likely need to be spoon fed to me, don't let that discourage anyone, I plan to learn from this so spoon away.
« Last Edit: May 07, 2016, 12:37:17 AM by ben8763 » Logged
bernard
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« Reply #1 on: May 07, 2016, 03:36:36 AM »

Horray ben!  Now just missing are pictures of your setup.  You have a Wacom UD-1218-R board?  That's a beast and is a great board. It once was a "dream" board.  Grin

If you got as far as flashing a CPU and trying other HID stuff, you are F-A-R from a novice sir. Sorry to say. A novice won't know that "HID" is not a verb in past tense about being concealed written in uppercase.

First some mechanical questions:

1- In case you thought about it, how do you see your Leostick fit in the picture? I see the stick has a "Male" type USB connector, that means it can plug directly into a computer. That might also mean that you might not put it inside the Wacom board.  
2- Are you ok with opening the Wacom and do some soldering (or maybe you already did all that?) -- (sorry if I missed earlier posts).
3- Did you want to re-use that Leostick for other purposes?  (being able to re-install it)?
4- Not sure if you knew but you can use the USB 5V to power your board (through the leostick) and thus let go of the bulky UD-1218-R power supply brick. Now THAT is awesome -- Welcome to the new millenium my *little* board! For that to work you *need* to solder.  
5- if you do not want to open the Wacom board and perform surgery, you will need to get more parts (connectors) -- which will cost more obviously

Second how do you flash this and which .hex was it?  

Did you mention you flashed WaxBee with the Intuos2 UD1218 template? I saw that the leostick bootloader takes 2K (which leaves 30K for WaxBee+template) -- which is great news. In comparison, the stock AVR bootloader takes 4K and the Teensy one takes 0.5K (which makes it more awesome but also why so many people are having issues setting up WaxBee in non-Teensy boards). Did you use a "stock" WaxBee .hex file or it was a custom build (maybe from someone else) to make it "smaller" (there are ways to make it smaller by removing the unused emulation pieces for instance -- but it is rather annoying to do since you need to setup the whole avr-toolchain compiler since this was not done using Arduino. (Arduino is very popular and easy to setup but it is also sadly one of the worst tool for programmers that do this for a living).

Third the emulation for Windows 10

Probably the way to go here is to emulate the Intuos5.  The emulation is a bit rough but the basics works. I am just worried that the Intuos5 device we currently emulate succesfully is a small board I believe.  It will "work". We should do the math if we will loose resolution.  The newer devices have much more precision, so we might get lucky.
« Last Edit: May 07, 2016, 03:39:53 AM by bernard » Logged
bernard
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« Reply #2 on: May 07, 2016, 04:16:48 AM »

Even with the high resolution per inch of the Intuos5 S, (actually it is "double" your tablet) the big difference in size of your board beats the total number of lines. In other words you will not have the maximum resolution your board can deliver (until we come up with a bigger emulation which would instantly make it better). But not to worry, it will still appear to work correctly -- actually, I believe you will not notice it. Let me demonstrate this with some numbers:

Let's do some math anyway to see what we are talking about here:

Tablet| WIDTH| HEIGHT| LPI| X LINES| Y LINES
UD-1218-R| 12 in| 18 in| 2540| 45720| 30480
Intuos 5 S| 8.8 in| 5.5 in| 5080| 31496| 19685

So if we take the number of X lines of the Intuos 5 S and divide it by the active area size (X) of the UD-1218-R, that should give us the resulting LPI on the X axis: (also we do this on the Y axis)

X: 31496 lines / 18 in = ~1750 lpi
Y: 19685 lines / 12 in = ~1640 lpi

So you will 'loose' ~31% (x axis) and ~35% (Y axis) of your original resolution of 2540 lpi. (~1750 lpi and ~1640 lpi respectively)

Still pretty good afterall
lpi stands for "Lines Per Inch" -- similar to DPI -- Dot Per Inch for a printer. Well the laser printer next to me can't go over 1200 dpi and I typically only print at 600 dpi. I mean, we are talking splitting a single inch into more than a *thousand*. We are talking drawing with a hand, not with a printer!  I do not know why Wacom go insane by bragging all this super-high-definition, I see not much point frankly.

Aspect Ratio

The other issue is the aspect ratio difference. Although it is "close" there is like ~110 lpi difference between the X and the y. That means the "dots" will not be "square". Again it might work and you might never notice it (this one probably more noticeable: drawing a circle would look a little bit squashed). Again, this is fixable but probably at the cost of dropping active area on the side - at least in one axis (or maybe two depending on the WaxBee setup AND settings in the Wacom driver).

Next post will do the math for rectifying the aspect ratio to perfect 1:1 square pixels.
« Last Edit: May 07, 2016, 04:35:20 AM by bernard » Logged
bernard
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« Reply #3 on: May 07, 2016, 05:58:49 AM »

Aspect Ratio

Typically your tablet is "mapped" to your screen. Well, surprise, surprise, your screen also has an aspect ratio! (16:9 for FullHD screens for instance).  The Intuos 5 S is 16:10.  Your UD-1218-R tablet is 3:2 -- matches photography but not screens and newer Wacom boards. (which tend to be 16:10 or 16:9 like screens nowadays). Matched ratios is a very common issue and the Wacom driver has a setting to "correct it" automagically.  Well... there is no magic: it will render *inactive* a portion of the tablet to "fit" (exactly the same for fitting an image to your desktop screen). But it will do so thinking your physical tablet is an Intuos 5 S -- not a UD-1218-R!  So although the setting in the Wacom driver is a good thing, it is not enough. We should "match" the Intuos 5 S using a similar mechanism:  cut out another portion of the tablet on top!

Aspect Ratio in WaxBee

We saw that the X has more resolution, so we will use that as the base and "reduce" the number of Y lines to match. That means the we will cut at the top and at the bottom.

To fit 18x12 in 16:10 ratio (i.e. 31496/19685 ratio):

18 / 31496*19685= 11.25 inches -- loosing 0.75in in total (or 0.375 inches at the top and bottom).

To achieve this we need to map the emulated Y coordinates to a smaller portion of the UD-1218-R vertical position.(this can be done by modifying your template).

On the UD-1218-R we have a total of 30480 lines -- if we remove 0.75 inches worth of lines or 30480 / 12 * 0.75 = 1905 (952 at the top and 953 at the bottom), in other words, instead of mapping the full 0 to 19685 range -- we map from 952 to 18732 -- effectively "cropping" our active area.

In summary your virtual tablet (that 100% matches the Intuos 5 S ratio) now is:

18 x 11.25 inches active area @ 1749.8 lpi -- ( 31496 x 17780 lines )

Aspect Ratio in Wacom driver

If your screen is a 16:10 -- (like 2304 x 1440 pixels for example) the story ends here -- your screen ratio perfectly matches the Intuos 5 S ratio.

If your screen is a 16:9 (most popular these days), then using the Wacom settings to "fix" the ratio will do more "damage". Here we have nothing to do, but we can compute what is going to happen. (in yet another post).  

In the meantime here's a picture of the ratio cutting that will happen.  The red part is what we will fix within the WaxBee configuration to "match" the Intuos 5 S, and the blue part is what the Wacom will do on top of it (if your screen is 16:9).


* RatioMapping.png (17.23 KB. 534x350 - viewed 76 times.)

« Last Edit: May 08, 2016, 01:37:40 AM by bernard » Logged
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« Reply #4 on: May 08, 2016, 01:39:16 AM »

Just saw from another post in this forum that they got the Intuos2 working on Windows 10 !   The driver they use has some glitches but appear to work for the most part.
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ben8763
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« Reply #5 on: May 09, 2016, 04:42:57 AM »

That's brilliant, I'll give it a try. Now to answer your questions

Everything is soldered up, I've just soldered on jumper wires which fit into pin headers on the Leostick so I can re-use it if need be, I'll be buying a USB female to male to extend the connection to my PC.

I flashed on the Intuos 2 UD-1218-r, used an Arduino Uno as an ISP and flashed it on using Avrdude.


EDIT: With the intuos 2 drivers, the UD-1218-r is recognized by the Wacom properties tool. Only problem now is I can't find the pen anywhere, any idea what pens are compatible with this board and where I can get one??
« Last Edit: May 09, 2016, 04:46:40 AM by ben8763 » Logged
ben8763
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« Reply #6 on: May 09, 2016, 07:25:46 AM »

UPDATE

I found a pen, it's not the original




Tablet is working, only issue is that this pen need to be held really close to the tablet to work almost touching, I wanted to turn this thing into a Cintiq clone in the future so that's not ideal, is there any way to extend the pen range? or will I need to find/buy the original?
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« Reply #7 on: May 09, 2016, 08:06:04 AM »

This pen looks OK. Probably you simply need to "tune" it.  There are tiny potentiometers behind the button.  Be extremely careful with removing the plastic -- I broke a few of those.  There are posts that tells how to dismantle it. (just hard to search).
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DaBotz
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« Reply #8 on: May 09, 2016, 09:55:23 PM »


...
lpi stands for "Lines Per Inch" -- similar to DPI -- Dot Per Inch for a printer. Well the laser printer next to me can't go over 1200 dpi and I typically only print at 600 dpi. I mean, we are talking splitting a single inch into more than a *thousand*. We are talking drawing with a hand, not with a printer!  I do not know why Wacom go insane by bragging all this super-high-definition, I see not much point frankly.
...


I thought that, when I bought the Intuos 2 to build my UBiQ - but, time (and my style) proved me wrong.

A lower LPI has no visible effect as long as you draw looking the drawing at "high zoom" (say, above 33%).

Bur I often zoom out and add a set of "final" etchings, while looking at the whole drawing reduced to half a screen height (so, around 10% of zoom).

When I do so, I care more about balancing the tones in the image and a lot less about "finesse"...

However, when I then zoom back, I now find that the lines are "jagged", even using Lazy Nezumi - the spatial resolution wasn't, really, enough for that task.

I remember having first seen this when I switched between the Intuos 4 in the Cabinetiq and the Graphire 4 that I used on my sofa.

Then I forgot it (rather, I thought that the likely jitter of almost any possible build made it a moot point) when I chased the XD-1218. 

However, the Intuos 3->Pro have not really such an incredible resolution.

The UC-Logic tablets have reached the same 5080 LPI ( 200 lines per mm ), and those plesiosaurus of the Calcomp have up to 12700 LPI...





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bernard
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« Reply #9 on: May 10, 2016, 03:51:38 AM »

The precision of the tablet has a limit and the software should handle this somehow. A single stroke is composed of points but physically, it is a "solid line" (curved). If the software does not handle recreating the original curve that means you can reproduce the same problem with any top tablet, just use a higher resolution image! 

In other words, the precision of the tablet is compensating for the software not doing its "job" really. I see you tried even with LazyNezumi which should have helped.

Long Shot:  What if LazyNemuzi can only stay within the emulated tablet's resolution?  What if we picked the highest resolution tablet (when emulating) to give LazyNezumi more "precision" when interpolating values to return to the system?
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bernard
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« Reply #10 on: May 10, 2016, 04:56:15 AM »

Found a picture of a dismantled pen in my old "Wacom Science" thread. http://forum.bongofish.co.uk/index.php?topic=1514.0   But it is wrong type.

This is a Intuos2: http://forum.bongofish.co.uk/index.php?topic=2198.msg17419#msg17419 full digital stuff. I see no pots in there (but I saw pots on other Intuos2 -- so it must be there?). And the button's plastic "snap" is completely different.

http://forum.bongofish.co.uk/index.php?topic=1721.msg12959#msg12959  tabs of the plastic thingy like the intuos2 -- again not matching your model

Another picture to stare at: http://www.surfaceforums.net/threads/help-with-stylus.13929/#post-111681

I am pretty sure I have a similar pen somewhere in here.

I'll continue searching...
« Last Edit: May 10, 2016, 05:14:56 AM by bernard » Logged
DaBotz
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« Reply #11 on: May 11, 2016, 08:55:20 PM »

The precision of the tablet has a limit and the software should handle this somehow. A single stroke is composed of points but physically, it is a "solid line" (curved). If the software does not handle recreating the original curve that means you can reproduce the same problem with any top tablet, just use a higher resolution image! 

In other words, the precision of the tablet is compensating for the software not doing its "job" really. I see you tried even with LazyNezumi which should have helped.

Long Shot:  What if LazyNemuzi can only stay within the emulated tablet's resolution?  What if we picked the highest resolution tablet (when emulating) to give LazyNezumi more "precision" when interpolating values to return to the system?


Lazy Nezumi introduces lag  - linearly with the size of the moving window, a bit more complicated to understand when you use a geometric average - which is not a problem when I am doing long, fluent lines, but is an hassle when I go in mode "crazy etcher" - and I do not really think that it can over-sample, interpolating between points... I suspect that it inserts a "filter driver" in the chain that goes from the kernel driver to the Wacom User service, and it must be "transparent" - it can't really double the maximum X value in output from the Intuos, without "crashing" the driver and its interface with the various graphic programs (which would use Floating point numbers?).

It is a mighty piece of software, but it still must play nice with the rest of the chain.
 
In reality, it was mainly me being dumb , scribbling on a 5000x6000 image when it is reduced to a 5x6 cm "icon"... 

With time, I learnt to refrain from such madness

(still, if I had a tablet with the Calcomp
space resolution, I would be back at that - if it was able to keep the pace of me scribbling, of course; The calcomp does not look very art-friendly; good for tracing pieces for CNC Machines and the like, OK. Art, not much... Never seen a video of anybody drawing a daring stroke on one of those things...).
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« Reply #12 on: May 13, 2016, 02:14:50 AM »

What software were you using when doing that 5 cm madness on a 5000 pixel image?
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« Reply #13 on: May 15, 2016, 01:19:06 AM »

It was Photoshop, I believe (which famously has no stabilization of its own, uhm... )

It has passed a bit of time since last time I did that, and now I have switched almost completely to Manga Studio (rotating Canvas! And perspective rulers! And the interface is light gray with black writes... ) with, as always, GIMP for the last steps (scripts for a set of automated tasks).

And, truth be told, in Manga Studio - it does not happen! You see a bit of "angularity" only at the minimum allowed zoom (0.8% ?), but not much, indeed.

Being at the end of the chain, it is possible for it to interpolate values, in ways that Lazy Nezumi can not, I think.

You were right.... 

Uh, now I have a reason less to want an Intuos 3 (I am left only with it being able to cover the missing inch of width of my 22" screen, whereas the XD-1218 falls 60 pixels short... ~17mm ; It is nowhere near enough... long live the Intuos2!!!!).
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« Reply #14 on: May 16, 2016, 07:03:28 AM »

Quote
Uh, now I have a reason less to want an Intuos 3 (I am left only with it being able to cover the missing inch of width of my 22" screen, whereas the XD-1218 falls 60 pixels short... ~17mm ; It is nowhere near enough... long live the Intuos2!!!!).

This sentence is too confusing for me to understand. If you are saying that you are in a situation where you need an extra "inch" of active area (and you have WaxBee powering the conversion), maybe you heard of the "trick" (or feature) to "extend" your activearea (to reach menus, scrolling bars or side palettes) with what I "call" anchors. (with anchors, you can configure a "position" (on an axis) where the pen "goes faster" to reach the edge than your pen -- it is not good for drawing obviously, but for menus and buttons, it can do the job).
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