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Author Topic: DIY Cintiq Companion [Design Phase]  (Read 6533 times)
Rubatonk
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« Reply #15 on: May 24, 2016, 08:52:53 PM »

Why do you insist on using bulky desktop tablets when there are tabletPC digitizers in the 13.3'' size you need? You even mentioned already having a 14'' one from a Gateway laptop, i don't get it... You're going for an "all-in-one PC" design from the looks of it, since there's no way you can power a desktop ITX motherboard with a battery or stick an adequate CPU heatsink there. But if that's the case, an 11.6 screen is terrible for an all-in-one...
I apologize as now i understand what you were referring to, i dont know very much about the wacom digitizer stuff and did not realize that you can just buy a separate unit from a laptop and convert and use it over usb so i thank you because that will indeed make things way easier for me
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Pesho
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« Reply #16 on: May 24, 2016, 09:26:37 PM »

TabletPC screens are the best choice since it's both a screen and tablet in the same unit, almost everything you need. Only downside is that they don't make them any larger than 14''.

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what tabletPC screens are in 13.3 size?

BOE/HYDIS HV133WX1-100  (used in Fujitsu Lifebook T900) - 1280x800 resolution. TabletPC screens are usually 12.1''. 13.3'' and 14'' exist, but aren't nearly as common. If you want higher resolution you're going to have to peel off the digitizer and try to adapt it to a different screen, as i mentioned previously. Worth noting is that most of those digitizers are pre-2010, so the aspect ratio is going to be 16:10 as opposed to the 16:9 that's common nowadays. There are newer-generation 16:9 digitizers like in the Fujitsu T902, but nobody here has any experience connecting them to USB.
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Rubatonk
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« Reply #17 on: May 24, 2016, 10:52:39 PM »

for now ill go the route of using the t900 screen as it wont cost me an arm and a leg, however once the price come's down on the t902 digitizer ill make a unit with that

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but nobody here has any experience connecting them to USB.
That means i'll eventually be the first XD, once i get more money or the price comes down ill pick one up and play around with it, currently they are $98 which saddens me. thank you for helping me with the design.

also

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You're going for an "all-in-one PC"
indeed that is what im going for that is why i chose the motherboard i did, its a special standard called thin mini itx. while yes it is a desktop board it is designed specifically for All in one pc's granted not as thin as im planning how ever there is enough room for a heatsink such as one you would find on a laptop but a bit more heavy duty, i do also plan on designing a custom board to plug into the pcie slot so i can use an MXM 3.0b graphics card unless i can find a board that intel showed off in there product catalog that has the MXM 3.0b as part of the motherboard.

The MXM slot has become a standardized slot for highend gaming/workstation laptops for special low power gpus generally if you see any laptop that has a quadro m gpu is has a mxm slot to support it.
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Rubatonk
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« Reply #18 on: May 25, 2016, 12:28:17 AM »

Ok i have once again remade the model with the t900 screen and i have to say it looks way better



And its now only 20mm thick and 15in diagonal Smiley

thanks once again to Pesho
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Pesho
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« Reply #19 on: May 25, 2016, 11:24:43 AM »

That means i'll eventually be the first XD, once i get more money or the price comes down ill pick one up and play around with it, currently they are $98 which saddens me. thank you for helping me with the design.

Yeah, that's more or less how much those (now cheap) 4:3 screens would cost around 2011-ish. Back then it made sense to use a regular desktop tablet at those sizes, nowadays it's easier. In theory hooking up a T902 screen should be easier with it being eDP and most likely native-USB on the digitizer side, but you need someone to play around with one and discover what the pinout is...

Not a big fan of MXM as it's still incredibly rare and exclusively owned by Nvidia... If i were going for an ITX board i'd pick an AMD platform with a socketed CPU since you can upgrade both the CPU and GPU by replacing just one, more commonly available unit. I'm curious as to how the LVDS connector on such a board works, i've only dealt with dedicated controllers...
« Last Edit: May 25, 2016, 11:26:19 AM by Pesho » Logged
Rubatonk
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« Reply #20 on: May 25, 2016, 12:34:42 PM »

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I'm curious as to how the LVDS connector on such a board works
well unfortunately it use's the intel integrated graphics only for the lvds connector so its just like an normal onboard display, however with the MXM it can use it as a video source if it is built in, with an mxm card it sends the display signal's through the socket itself whereas normal graphics card do not which make a really cool technology, im currently working on two things. im working on a possible pcie 4x to MXM adapter that has the edp/lvds connector and the board it plug's into im just working on figuring out the pin out since nvidia only give's the information to the board partners. another thing im working which is my priority is the battery charging circuit which is currently hurting my head a bit. why do i do these things before i drink a pot of coffee Sad
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XDjackieXD
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« Reply #21 on: May 26, 2016, 01:27:16 AM »

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but nobody here has any experience connecting them to USB.
That means i'll eventually be the first XD, once i get more money or the price comes down ill pick one up and play around with it, currently they are $98 which saddens me. thank you for helping me with the design.

You will probably not have any problems with the USB digitizers if the Windows drivers work. I got 2 penabled USB digitizers here and both work out of the box with Linux (you just need a 3.3V regulator and some wires). Certainly a lot less of a problem than serial ones...
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XDjackieXD
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« Reply #22 on: May 26, 2016, 01:32:56 AM »

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I'm curious as to how the LVDS connector on such a board works
well unfortunately it use's the intel integrated graphics only for the lvds connector so its just like an normal onboard display, however with the MXM it can use it as a video source if it is built in, with an mxm card it sends the display signal's through the socket itself whereas normal graphics card do not which make a really cool technology, im currently working on two things. im working on a possible pcie 4x to MXM adapter that has the edp/lvds connector and the board it plug's into im just working on figuring out the pin out since nvidia only give's the information to the board partners. another thing im working which is my priority is the battery charging circuit which is currently hurting my head a bit. why do i do these things before i drink a pot of coffee Sad

The mobile GPUs usually don't have any screen output (at least the ones I encountered didn't) as the video signal gets passed back to the integrated Intel GPU via the PCIe bus. I just built an Expresscard to PCIe adapter today and connected a full featured GPU to my laptop and I can install the nvidia optimus drivers and use them as if it were a built-in GPU ^^
(hint for a lot of know-how for PCIe releated stuff: https://duckduckgo.com/?q=site%3Ahwtools.net%2FPDF&t=canonical&ia=web this company doesn't know how to secure internal documents and they are worth gold - or at least a good amount of time not wasted on trial and error :3)

EDIT: apparently I only saw mPCIe x16 for laptop GPUs but never a MxM card. They do have LVDS and DP according to the documentation... ._.
This may be useful for you: http://www.zentrica.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/04/HD7970M-MXM-3-0-SPEC.pdf
« Last Edit: May 26, 2016, 01:39:06 AM by XDjackieXD » Logged
Rubatonk
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« Reply #23 on: May 26, 2016, 02:34:11 PM »

yes for the mxm card i was able to find documentation on a random chineese website that stated is that they send the display signals through the pcie, so even though they dont have the output itself on the card's i can build a midway card that has the video out port on it that i could then use.
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XDjackieXD
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« Reply #24 on: May 26, 2016, 06:12:42 PM »

What CPU and CPU cooler do you intend to use? This motherboard takes CPUs up to 95W TDP which is a lot for the planned dimensions...
Maybe you could try to use the cooling solution of an older "Gaming" laptop?
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Rubatonk
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« Reply #25 on: May 26, 2016, 06:54:14 PM »

Im planing on using an intel i5 4670t as for the gpu that depends on if im able to make the MXM to PCIe adapter. if i cant then im stuck with the intel integrated graphics, however if i can i want to use a quadro k4100m

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Maybe you could try to use the cooling solution of an older "Gaming" laptop?

Precisely what i was planing on doing for prototyping purpose's, however in the end im going to make my own as i am fortunate enough to have access to a CNC machine.

i have not posted much of an update because im hurting my head designing the power/battery charging board, the battery i sourced is one used in the alienware m14x. its a 4 cell battery so it a pain since i have to adapt the balancing circuit but since its a 63wh battery its perfect for this build and then i also plan to use a M.2 SSD and if there is enough space a second SATA SSD
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Rubatonk
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« Reply #26 on: May 26, 2016, 07:38:29 PM »

This is an over simplified schematic of what im making



as you can see when it is plugged in the battery will charge while the system is still getting power and once is unplugged the battery supply's the power

im going to use the Texas instruments BQ24707a controller chip so it is easy for me to program it
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XDjackieXD
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« Reply #27 on: May 26, 2016, 09:15:24 PM »

For battery charging you could take a look at the novena open hardware laptop. they have some pretty cool circuitry there and use standard LiPo batteries used for RC vehicles (high capacity, low weight and very cheap to get).
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Ertew
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« Reply #28 on: May 26, 2016, 10:57:21 PM »

Ok i have once again remade the model with the t900 screen and i have to say it looks way better

And a lot more space for battery.
Btw, My T5010 screen looks same as T900, except T5010 is glossy while T900 looks mat.


This is an over simplified schematic of what im making



as you can see when it is plugged in the battery will charge while the system is still getting power and once is unplugged the battery supply's the power

im going to use the Texas instruments BQ24707a controller chip so it is easy for me to program it
Lower diode is useless. In that configuration You can charge battery but cannot power the mobo.

IMO making good charger/balancer for Lithium batteries is too complex to deal with it. The better way are to use simple components and connect it together like puzzles.

If You want to go that way, BQ24707a is good choice to be a charger controller and maybe capacity counter but need another uC to manage charging states and cut-off.
Don't forget to add balancer. Simple balancer for RC things is very good as long as You can disconnect it after charging - probably You need a set of relays powered from input power supply.
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Rubatonk
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« Reply #29 on: May 26, 2016, 11:09:13 PM »

The main issue im having is i only understand part of what i need to create the power circuit, this is the schematic i want to use for this but i dont know what the host is, as in the SMBus, dig I/O, or ADC or how i can connect to it through these things to program the voltages
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